A few thoughts on the Wiley and Jay Sean beef
- February 6th, 2011
- Posted in Analysis
- By djmutiny
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I’ve no idea how the beef started, but the “racial banter” (as Wiley called it) started when some Asian Jay Sean fans sent Wiley abusive tweets. “Asian people tried it with me I’m allowed to talk back”.
Wiley’s retort to the Jay Sean fans unfortunately included some pretty silly playground taunts (which, as a half-Asian, I am all too familiar with).
– “i will throw Bombay potatoes on you”
– “your mum makes a dodgy korma”
– “Stop chewing beetle nut on the bus it smells”
Not exactly the kind of brilliant inventiveness that Wiley used to create the grime scene, but there you go. For the record, my house *does* smell of curry right now, cos I just made a very tasty aloo gobi.
In response to accusations that he was racist, Wiley explained that he had love for Asians and was just engaging in a bit of “racial banter”, which, he correctly pointed out, is not uncommon in London.
– “come on you know me i wouldnt wait 32 years to be racist”
– “lol at you idiots getting over excited instead of understanding the meaning of ethnic banter”
– “I love the Asian community minus Jay Sean trust me bug up Preeya she is so special”
Wiley finally pulled the plug on his 24-hour rant this evening, phoning into the Bobby Friction show, and later tweeting: “hold tight the jay sean fans you love me really lets get some unity going on im ready to chill out now its all love and banter racial banter”
It’s important not to blow Wiley’s rant out of proportion. People labelling him as a racist and likening him to the far right is unhelpful and only feeds into the lack of unity in our communities.
Wiley reveals the root of his grudge pretty clearly when he says: “im sorry but your race do act like they are above black people no lie”.
Frankly, he’s right about this. Many Asians *do* act like they are above people of African origin. I know from personal experience that there is deep-seated prejudice against black people in the Asian community, and this is a very real problem in terms of creating the unity that we need to move forward against oppression.
Wiley brings up another touchy subject when he says: “you all are starting to act blAck talk black fuck off tho cos I am black so I see who tries to be like us and ur haircuts are so swag and they way you wear ya hats deadout”
That is: not only do you look down on us, but you do it at the same time as biting our music and culture (and, in Jay Sean’s case, getting rich in the process).
Without necessarily meaning to do so, Wiley has brought out some very deep issues that need to be addressed. The fact is that the Asian community does pride itself on its economic success and the fact that Asian children tend to thrive in the education system. Many Asians see that African Caribbeans have not had the same economic and educational successes, and put this down to some kind of racial inferiority, without seeing the systematic racism, victimisation, criminalisation and prejudice that is designed to keep the descendants of slaves at the bottom of the heap.
The whole situation is strongly reminiscent of the media storm that happened in the US when legendary rapper Ice Cube (formerly of NWA) made the track ‘Black Korea’, in response to the brutalisation of black customers in Korean groceries.
Every time I want to go get a fucking brew
I gotta go down to the store with the two
Oriental one-penny-counting motherfuckers;
They make a nigger mad enough to cause a little ruckus.
Thinking every brother in the world’s out to take,
So they watch every damn move that I make.
They hope I don’t pull out a Gat, try to rob
Their funky little store but, bitch, I got a job.So don’t follow me up and down your market
Or your little chop suey ass will be a target
Of a nationwide boycott.
Juice with the people, that’s what the boy got.
So pay respect to the black fist
Or we’ll burn your store right down to a crisp.
And then we’ll see ya
‘Cause you can’t turn the ghetto into black Korea.
The lyrics were obviously problematic and divisive; but nonetheless they brought out an issue that actually existed and needed talking about. Meanwhile, the reaction of mainstream US was to label Ice Cube as a murderous racist and to push for a ban of his music (thus conveniently avoiding the issue of racial disunity and how it can be overcome).
The best response to Wiley’s rant is not to chastise or alienate Wiley, or to label him as equivalent to the far right; it is to reflect seriously on the issues that have been raised and to move forward in the spirit of unity. While we fight amongst ourselves, the power structure of this country (which is overwhelmingly rich, white and male) laughs itself silly and enjoys the thought that nobody is going to seriously challenge it any time soon.
OR WILEY’S JUST CARRYING ON WHERE HE LEFT WITH PRO GREEN / CHIPMUNK OR WHO EVER TRYING TO COURSE AS MUCH CONTROVERSY WHETHER THAT BE BY USING RACIST REMARKS OR WHAT TO DRAW ATTENTION TO HIMSELF AND HIS DEAD SHORT LIVED MUSIC CAREER !
I’M SICK OF THE GUY TO BE HONEST – HE HANGS ON TO THIS KING OF GRIME “UK BLACK MUSIC” TAG AS IF GRIME WAS THE FIRST AND ONLY BLACK MUSIC SCENE TO FORM OUT OF THE UK WITHOUT ACKNOWLEDGING OR PAYING DUES TO D&B JUNGLE SCENES.
“Frankly, he’s right about this. Many Asians *do* act like they are above people of African origin.”
well what about white people (yes i did read the final para). And by asian…i presume you mean what??? the whole continent of asia, including chinese, japanese, malaysian…..
This article is so fundamentally flawed in many, many ways. Its almost attempting to blame the problems of the afro-carribean/black communities, here in the UK, on people of “asian” descent.
What about wileys comments about turbans, and his derogatory mention of Allah. Actually insinuating that Jay Sean is muslim…… smdh.
He does know that their is a very large black muslim population in this country, who do not appreciate such comments, about that which is most precious to them.
Ask yourself this, is it jay sean who raps about “tools, guns, and packing heat”, or is it the likes of wiley????
Is it asians, who are stabbing other youths of” afro-carribean/black communities”, or is it usually, black on black crime???
“Many Asians see that African Caribbeans have not had the same economic and educational successes, and put this down to some kind of racial inferiority, without seeing the systematic racism, victimisation, criminalisation and prejudice that is designed to keep the descendants of slaves at the bottom of the heap.”
Another heap of crap, its the likes of wiley who glamorise drug dealing. Mention the price of cocaine in many of the lyrics for their music. Drug dealing = more crime…
So tell me, is it asians who are victimizing, or criminalising the black youth, or are the asians just going about their business, and actually becoming quite successful, by in large in fields such as education…
As are MANY black people, moreso in the fields of sport in the UK, than people of asian descent.
Yet again, same old wiley, careers at the end of its tether, hes washed up, “OH, i know, ill start some serious controversy to get me back in the limelight again……”
Wiley doesnt give a shit about Black people, or “the hood”, thats why he lives in his mansion in the country.
Black people, asians. There never was a debate. The problems of ethnic minorities do not come from black vs asian.
Dont be fooled by the game that wiley is playing.
I agree with the gist of your article, black and Asian people do have deep rooted issues. However, how can you compare the WHOLE Asian community with Afro-Caribbeans in terms of education? If I compared Bangladeshis with Afro-Caribbeans then levels of education are actually similar. The prison rates of Pakistanis and Afro-Caribbeans are also leveling off. Africans and people of Indian descent have similar education attainment levels.
The fact is immigration from Asian communities tends to come from the middle class whereas West Indian people who arrive here are generally working class.Therefore, the people who come reach similar economic statuses that they would of had if they stayed in their native land. This is evident by the millions of poor people in Asia.This is not to say poverty is not everywhere, but your article suggests that West Indian people are not really successful.
To the person who said blacks are more successful at sport disregards Asian successes in Cricket. The fact is people are people and the only thing that realistically separates us is money. There are always going to more poor people than rich in this world.
TBH, black and Asian people suffer so much racism that it is senseless to argue amongst ourselves. If a fascist party comes into power in this country, both blacks and Asians are going home.
Identity politics is futile and only further divides people. Wiley’s comments are racist regardless of the context of the argument. He needs to address it and move on.
@anon
I don’t think you have listened to Wiley’s lyrics before
If you had done some research before you posted your ignorant comment, Wiley does not advocate violoence or drug dealing he merely comments on where he has come from…
“Change your ways, try to understand life before you pull a trigger and take another life, I think life is worth more than drugs and money”
And I’d like to further add there is tension between the black and asian community, we saw this bubble up in Birmingham a few years ago, these issues do need to be addressed, in my opinion we are all on the same side, there is a real need for unity, our cultures have more similarities than we do to our host nation…
Actually kojo, go and listen to taliban, and do an analysis of that.. “what 28g, what 28g….the price is going up…..the price of cokes going up”.
a hobby following the price of coke, or is he a coke broker?
Dont chat bullshit.
And those problems in Birmz only happened because of those trying to escalate the situation rather than diffuse it.
From both sides.
Posted via http://www.vastbrowser.com
Alright any how forget the lyrics, what Wiley did was not right now was it???
How can you be posting racist comments om twitter about the Asian minorities in the UK????
If statistics were to be put forward it will obviously be clear that Asian contribute much much more to the UK economy than the BALCKS as far as education BULLLLLSHIT poverty we have a system in place called the “STUDENT LOANS COMPANY” where every asian borrows money to fund higher education why cant your black people do that???
Bout we want to copy the black culture??? Why you black people after curry all the time?
Wiley was wrong in one massive way. If some fools are racist to him and to the black community that doesn’t justify him responding in racist terms. That just shows him to be a stupid kid. He made some comments, and in those he was wrong too.
Yeah those asian kids were waaaay wrong in saying shit to him, but he should have risen above it.
Man showed is immaturity and did himself no favours. He’s finished anyway, let him just chat his shit and leave to the side.
What’s this “asian” garbage? I didn’t see any Japanese fighting blacks in Birmingham. Hm maybe all asians look the same. “Bloody foreigners the same the lot of them, all fighting each other.”
The fights in Birmingham were between uneducated yoof of Pakistani and Bangladeshi origin and Black yoof of Afro-Caribbean origin. All Asians are not the same. There are Mongolians, Chinese, Japanese, Indians, Pakistanis, Bangladeshis etc etc all come from Asia.
Black people in the UK have a choice to study or not to study, and overwhelmingly, they don’t study. That’s why Chinese, Japanese and Indians do better, full stop. People like Wiley feed Afro ignorance talking about cars, casual sex, violence, drugs, fast money etc. “I’m a bad boy because my council estate has lots of crime”. Get over it. Ever heard that Chinese song with the lyrics “all my chinkies in the house pop your gat”? No?
Some interesting stats here…
http://www.education.gov.uk/rsgateway/DB/SFR/s000900/index.shtml
If you take the poorest students as being eligible for free school meals, then you see that Chinese and Indians quite clearly do the best. It’s nothing to do with poverty or colour or slavery. It’s a matter of Black Caribean educational culture being inferior to Black African educational culture and most other educational cultures. It’s quite interesting is that White British poor do very badly too – worse than poor Black Caribbeans.
“prejudice that is designed to keep the descendants of slaves at the bottom of the heap”? I Disagree.
Everyone’s talking about communities that divide but even within their own communities there is division. Muslims v Sikh v Hindus (further divided into “caste banter”) and then Blacks v Mixed Race, and the volatality of the outbursts are not a great indication that all is well between us all.
For the Asians that started throwing the abuse in the first instance (if this was the case, I haven’t been privvy to the tweets) it’s totally unacceptable but for Wiley – dude in the public eye who some may look up to and respect – to retaliate in the way he did was just as ridiculous.
He mentioned (in the interview) about school playground – he’s no longer in the playground, he’s an adult in the public eye who has a social responsibility. How can young kids tell the difference between “ethnic banter” and bullying, the next piece on the news will be some schoolkid stabbing because of “ethnic banter” gone wrong.
I disagree with Asians solely thinking they are better than African-Carribean descent, as the situation is also vice versa where Asians are thought by African Carribeans to be scum of the earth, so where do you start to draw the line?
Nothing will get solved through blame culture, and again, nor will tarring entire communities through the actions and words of a minority.
There are bigger things out there in the world, why do minorities love to turn on one another with all the struggle everyone has faced against the white people – oh my god, I said white people but don’t worry – it’s just ethnic banter…
All people born in the uk have equal opportunities and rights even though they may be clouded by the white Supremecy, asians and blacks are the same, though it appears asians are not stuck in the past and would rather move forwards and thrive whereas the majority of black people find it relevant to remind everybody of their ancestors past. The white supremecy however is far amongst us as they leave us to argue and cause conflict giving them an excuse to blame us non whites for everything from crime rates to reccesion. It is time for us to unite as the minority, we all know wiley is long gone and more of a child who wants to prove himself to the world , tho its funny how a white ‘celeb’ wud never stoop this low, personally we are just fueling the label of the minority all us non whites are. It is time for us to unite!
…’Tho its funny how a white ‘celeb’ would never stoop this low’…Are you being serious or sarcastic?
If it’s the former then I guess you haven’t seen or heard anything about this, which was made with no antagonism/provocation whatsoever http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75yifjn7bHo
Or what about these, perhaps? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwWAeufYTlM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GyPa9OEQqUo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ui1jPNDWArM
You can say what you want about some of those instances being in private. Nevertheless, the fact remains that the conversations were filmed or tape-recorded and subsequently got leaked, end of story.
One more thing; however well-intentioned you believe your words to be, please don’t make flippant comparisons between asians moving forward in contrast to ‘the majority of black people [who] find it relevant to remind everybody of their ancestors past’. Comments like that are the height of condenscension. Don’t presume to have a better measure of black people than you actually do.
Nevertheless, despite everything aforementioned, I definitely understand and can relate to the general tone and overall message of your post (re: white supremacy, scapegoatism regarding crime/racial profiling, the counter-productive/doubly disadvantageous nature of conflict between ‘minority’ groups), so respect to you for that.
Trust me, there’s much more to be said about this whole ‘Twitter Beef’ issue and I intend to make another post or two, so please don’t look at this as me just singling you out. Feel free to respond if or whenever you wish to. The same goes for anybody who sees this.
Bless
acting black was invented by white people.
this article is full of faults and is biased.
asians do not resent black people.
look at kenya- the asians had to leave due to war.
acting black was invented by white people to promote blackness in the usa.
africans dont act black, they are genuine people just like genuine indians.
“Ethnic Banter” is just a pathetic excuse for peple to make comments to offend another culture or race. Its alright for Wiley to keep repeating that he is “only human” but he isnt like the rest of us..he is looked up to by many people and has a role to play he should be setting an example to those who follow him and listen to him, with the publicity that follows his career. If he can’t do that then he shouldn’t be in the industry he is in, because being a role model is part of the package of being a music artist
The comments that Wiley made towards the asian community were disgusting and unacceptable on any level, be it if he said it, I said it, anyone. It was wrong. Yes, people may have provoked him but two wrongs do not make a right. Also, at the age of 32 he should know better than to retaliate to others.
I also don’t understand why Wiley has so much beef against Jay Sean, he should be happy for him, because Jay Sean has only done what everybody else is working towards. I’m sure thay if Wiley was in the position he would take advantage of it just as Jay has. Making comments like “he doesn’t care” was irrelevent and uncalled forM and then to continue with statements like “I have love for asians minus Jay Sean” is just childish and pathetic for a man of his age. Jay Sean wasn’t giving him beef , it was his followers, all he did was trying to clear up statements that Wiley has made about him. I’m sure that if anyone had made a statement about Wiley he would be quick to clear it up or defend himself.
And then to top off what has happened, on the Bobby Friction show he tries to justify what he has said. Speaking on my own behalf and no one else, he has definatley lost a follower. He may have love for asians, but me being being an asian has NO LOVE for him!!!
Ok this ting wid wiley n gay sean its a media stunt really look wiley your old mate in other terms you got some washed out lyrics (i wana c a ice cream van on road i wana c a light skin gyal on da road ) cmon grandad youre nt da king of grime anymore skepta moved in lol he made youre place his place fam so how you gna diss ppl like gay sean n skepta bbk fam by da way you still owe my boy for a gram of coke dnt say its a lie coz you no da truth before you were famous da asians used to sell drugs to u grandad top shotta . U need tom tom in bow cuz bt i thought it was your hood dats how you no old age starting to kick in .
And gay sean sorry bt da g word my j dnt work his made $ cash money bt allow it u no his dat corner shop indian type never let of da penny bt gay sean go easy i aint a hater bt ur to big headed dats y grandads com bully u be yourself dnt mr muscle wid ribber lips yea be real p.
By da way i aint racist towards blacks or asian coz am bit of both breed get me star jus wiley a fool personal ting gwanin dwn .